Toward Ecosophy

I have noticed a fair few supposed Asatruar who are very triggered by my Heathenism not being the same standard Ctrl-left universalist dogma flavored up in horny helmets, plastic Mjolnirs and plastic Ralph Blum rune sets.

Dear JMG,

I have been a Wiccan of one kind or another for over forty years. OMGs, how did that happen? :) Currently I circle with a coven of California Line Gardnarians. Everyone I know has noticed a falling off in students looking for teaching and initiation in the better known traditions, such as Gardnarian, Alexandrian, etc. and more people claiming to be eclectic, traditional, hedge-witch, etc. Part of this can be attributed to the availability of contacts, groups, texts, etc. online. No more scanning notices at the local occult book store or posting signs written in Theban on phone poles to locate lost contacts. Increased scholarly attention has also affected the scene. The Matriarchal worshipers of the Great Mother Goddess (TM) have disappeared under academic scrutiny as have the unbroken lineages, initiations by grandmothers who would have been shocked to the depths of their Chapel going souls by the suggestion, and other standbys of the 60s, 70s and 80s.

Maybe all of this is leading to a circle the wagons mentality. There was some overlap between the re-constructionist Druids and the Wiccans i.e. Isaac Bonewits of Ar nDraoicht Fein was also a New Reformed Orthodox Order of the Golden Dawn initiate as well as a Gardnarian, and he certainly wasn't the only one with overlapping and somewhat incongruent memberships. Pushing toward greater unity could go either direction; either get all the Druids AND OTOs out of our Wicca or get all those Wiccans out of our Hellenic Temenos.


Rita

I've noticed it as well. It does seem to be a mix of both religious and political issues that come up. A very large number of pagans I know seem to feel that being anything other than a liberal is somehow incompatible with paganism, and I've gotten kicked out of groups on more than one occasion for not being liberal enough.

I've also noticed that whatever deity the Wiccans are communing with when they talk about the "Goddess" seems a little intolerant and aggressive, from my experience with her. Indeed, she strikes me as being quite dangerous. I don't dispute her power, but her morality is questionable.

What gets me more concerned is that I've noticed an odd sort of moralizing coming from the Wiccans I used to know, which has frankly pushed me away completely. It's not just that they are the real pagans, but also that a large number of them seem to be starting to think that what other pagans do is not just wrong, but fundamentally immoral.

I wonder if what we're witnessing isn't a revitalization movement getting started. Despite what most Wiccans say, they are by and large as committed to the industrial world as the majority of the population, and the strain as this world gives way to a much poorer one, with many more problems, has to be taking its toll. Insisting that Wiccan spirituality can save us, but only if we all hold hands and worship the Goddess together, is a nice way to avoid dealing with that reality.

Will J

JMG,

I've tried to hang out with a few Neopagan groups and meet people in the community locally. We used to have a Pagan pride day here where I live, but it tanked a few years ago and never came back. I met with an ADF group that would get together with a Wiccan group. It was kind of funny, all the ADF Druids were men, and the women were Wiccans. The ADF guys were friendly enough, and even paid you high compliments when I brought up that I was a fan. I just wasn't interested however in their approach. The Wiccans on the other hand were definitely not nice. They made a joke about throwing my kid in the fire, which scared my son and pissed me off. That was the last time I attempted to hang out with anyone from the local Neopagan community. And frankly from reading some of their blogs from time to time, I've realized that they are going in a different direction then I am interested in going. I'm sure there are great Wiccan people out there, but the ones I met really soured me. They sort of treated me like how they were complaining about how Christians treat them which is weird because I'm definitely a polytheist magic practicing person. I would think we would have more in common. I pretty much just identify myself as an occultist and am good with that.

Best Regards,
Dean Smith

I have not experienced this myself, probably because I don't belong to any groups or really talk about what I do with anybody outside my house. It took me 10 years of being a regular reader of your various blogs before I even felt comfortable posting to these extremely well moderated forums. However, a couple ideas came to mind that might be pertinent.

I've read Robert Trubshaw's "Anglo-Saxon Twilight" articles several times each. http://www.indigogroup.co.uk/twilight/ He's spent years trying to figure out how the Anglo-Saxons worshipped and what they believed in the years 500 - 900 CE. One of his conclusions is that each and every region worshipped the local spirit of place and that there were no consistent beliefs. I've read this also about the Scandinavian religions of the era. Sorta like modern Druidry. No dogma.

His ideas and some of what you've said agree: the newer monotheist religion required a more uniform belief, action and thought system. We live in a society in which it is impossible to not be impacted by vestiges of this monotheist religion. So, eventually, because that's how we (or our parents and/or grandparents) grew up, and because that's what we're used to, the demand for adherence to an authority, a dogma, will occur.


Some of what you and others have said above, especially regarding the visible failings of the religion of progress, has to be an impetus. Then add in furthur insecurities, including but not limited to the declining membership rates, and because many of us fall under the generalized "Pagan" heading, well, then, we all MUST believe the same and do what the self-appointed authorities decree. We all must be the same or fail. And since Wicca is bigger than all the rest of the groups combined, well, you're seeing what's happening.

It is disconcerting, to say the least.

DJSpo

I strongly suspect the bizarre critique of your work has much to do with the general crackup of the American left. A recent attempt at debate with a Unitarian minister turned into a 45-minute discussion about the rules of debate. Short version: Reality is whatever he wants it to be. Well then there now. Some of the better educated women in my family display a similar shrill, one-zero, bad tempered, mean spirited orthodoxy on a range of issues. Interestingly, they HATE the ideas in Green Wizardry. (Mom likes it. Her influence may prevail.) My working hypothesis is that the end of fossil fuel and other hard limits are also the end of fashionably bohemian lifestyles – and that simply will not do! No more oil means no more energy slaves and no more fashionable feminism. (Gender roles? Social strata? Unthinkable!) Interestingly, people I talk with on the American center to right tend to like Green Wizardry. Hmmm…
Rusty Retrofit, Tower 440 GWB&PA

While the intolerance that you are describing is not great, I wondered whether there is another concept that might be relevant. The concept that I am thinking of might lead to the type of comment that you have described.

I get a sense that some of us are looking towards what we have in common. There is overlap between Wicca and Druidry even if Druids are less likely to take our clothes off... It may be that the concept of overlap, commonality, is one that is both useful and problematic. Protestants and Catholics know this quite well.

In calling you wrong, wrong, wrong, perhaps the person is trying to squeeze the big tent to Paganism into to a small yurt.

Does that mean we should stop thinking about our commonalities and trying to appreciate them? In my mind no, it simply says this person doesn't understand diversity.

I have a similar issue from an entirely different background. I'm a moderately conservative Muslim following the traditions of the Nimatullahi Sufi Order, as it exists primarily in Iran, although I am not a member of the order. My mother was member but I never actually joined. At least once a year I meet someone who claims to know all about this tradition, and usually the traditions that follow from Rumi as well, and then goes on to castigate me for my conservative attitude and my religious observance. Usually I ignore them. When I'm in a less forgiving mood I ask whether they are aware that that the founders of these traditions were quite conservative, well known scholars of Islamic law, and not at all inclined to liberal views of religion or social policy? In decades past the response was often curiosity but these days I get some actual hostility and even people who double down on their insistence that I'm wrong about my own tradition. All of this very odd since I'm not obviously religious myself and am more than happy to let them take whatever value and interpretation they want from these traditions. In fact the more lenient I am with them concerning their own interpretation the more hostility I usually receive.

I started out as a “Wiccan” type Witch as a teen in the early ‘90s when there was plenty of beginner material laying around but not much advanced stuff that was specific to Wicca (though there was other advanced material everywhere- advanced folk magic, advanced ceremonial magic, advanced levels of most specialized skills like Tarot). Back then, there were complaints that a percentage of Wiccans wandered into ceremonial magic when they ran out of challenging practices in Wicca, so a few authors were beginning to offer more advanced works on Wicca. They didn’t publish material fast enough for me, so I wandered into the neopagan reconstructionists and never looked back. It leads me to speculate that maybe a lot more advanced works got written and created an echo chamber in the purely Wiccan faction of Wicca (perhaps those most virulently opposed to cultural appropriation).

I do value my Wiccan background though, because without a first step there would never have been a second step. And for this reason I apologize for your treatment from the bottom of my heart. To me, dogma sounds like the mirror opposite of a true pagan worldview and I don’t think it has a place in any polytheist religion (though it can sprout anywhere, I guess).

I can only speculate about the person’s motivations, but it sounds to me like the classic rookie mistake of assuming the first thing you read is the right way. I think I probably stumbled across my first bit of conflicting Occult information in the second book I read, promptly to have both books contradicted by the third. I don’t understand how anyone could study the Occult for any length of time and assume there is only one way to do anything. I suspect perhaps the author in question may have ego issues. I do not remember much material in early Wicca that was designed to “kill the ego” as you have called it (or even to put it down for a nap). Wicca is still a very young religion, it may take some time for the cream to rise. However, there are still
some incredibly wise and humble Wiccans out there, and you may not recognize them since they aren’t coming out of the woodwork to tell you how to magick.

The Pagan scene in the nearby cities does value diversity and our Chicago Pagan Pride organizer is a gem of a woman who clearly values diversity in religion. She is liberal but she is also open to alternate political views as well, which is a lot more rare. I am hoping the Heathen religions will balance the red and blue in the force ;) so that Pagans will remember to be tolerant of other political affiliations.

In rural areas , I’ve encountered more people who only identify as Witches and tend to study more magic and less religion. They are also influenced by Wicca but not dogmatic about it.

I do agree that generic Wiccan rituals can sometimes be utterly disappointing, especially if written or designed by relatively inexperienced practitioners. It starts to feel like the exact same ritual all over again. I think most festivals would benefit tremendously from a wider variety of rituals of various backgrounds. In some cases I think this may be a lack of volunteers, where the best practitioners and groves/covens have nothing to prove so the ones who lack experience or have character defects are overrepresented (like the loudest people are usually the ones with the least to say). I myself have led some *not great* rituals in the transition from “solitary ritual” to “inviting friends over for ritual” before learning how to scale things and how to help people participate who have no idea what’s going on. I don’t have confidence that I could lead a festival ritual with my current group (mostly because our total 3-5 people would need to be REALLY IMPRESSIVE to create effects dramatic enough to keep the attention of a festival size group, and we aren’t there yet!!! But in a festival of 10 people we could steal the show!!!!! Hahaha)

Wiccan book sales did peak in 2007, but it was the fastest growing religion in the 1990s so it makes sense that it would start to lose steam. I would like to know what the total numbers of Occultists and Pagans look like... are those total numbers still growing rapidly? I suspect Heathenism is growing a lot right now, based on seeing it nowhere 10 years ago to seeing it a lot now. I am hoping yes, and I hope it is part of a broader societal change rejecting scientific materialism.

I just want to end this by saying there are bad apples in every religion and it’s not fair to judge the whole of a religion by the behavior of its worst representatives (if we did that, we’d have to give up all the religions AND atheism.... an interesting trick if we could pull it off). I think the goals of Wicca are noble and its values are virtuous, even though sometimes some people screw up the execution. I think it will be a beautiful, powerful, vibrant religion in a hundred years, if it adjusts to a more modest rate of growth. Even if it falls in history’s dustbin, it has made some interesting and beautiful contributions to the Western Occultism, just like so many other traditions that have come and gone.

I’m terribly sorry that such a widely respected Archdruid and mage has suffered such undignified treatment, and I am saddened that the bad behaviors of a few people are tarnishing the reputation of other Wiccans. I sincerely hope that wisdom prevails in more and more of humanity’s interactions in the future, and I hope that the wise elders of the Wiccan community clamp down on this sort of behavior before it does any more damage.

Very sincerely,
Jessi Thompson
anotheramethyst